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Forums General Chit-Chat Debates Episode 1: Too many people.

Donator Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/25 02:34:01 )



PLEASE READ THIS POST BEFORE READING OTHER POSTS!
My favorite season is Debate Season which occurs every three years here in the US,
for our politicians to place their bids- stroke their own egos and get out there and fight for their
subjective opinion of the Merican' Dream. This debate season lasts late June 2019 through November 2020.

After I expressed my cynical excitement for this time of year, a few volties expressed interest
in hearing my sarcastic thoughts and interpretations. So I've put this thread together to do just that.
BUT! With the sensitive nature of politics I need to establish a few cut and
dry disclaimers.


1) Like most humans, I am a creature that is subject to this thing called confirmation bias.
I will not be going out of my way to filter this, in this thread. Therefore, this thread should NOT be used or interpreted
as a resource, educational, or otherwise serious. If you're genuinely intellectually interested in American politics,
you need to do your own research, and come to your own conclusions.




2) I will be poking fun at all candidates, yes even the one that is your and my own 'uber favorite'. It's in good natured fun.
Personally, I find humor in cynicism as well. This type of humor style might upset you, I won't be a edge lord by any degree
but you might read some things that are oof.



3) If I post anything that is blatantly false Please call that out!. Some things aren't up for opinion and are blatant false facts, if I fall prey to this and you do happen to notice it- don't hesitate to call me out. Just provide a source and I'll smack myself and fix it. I don't mind spreading my opinion, but I do not want to spread misinformation.



4) I don't want it to get stuffy in here. If you want to full on debate politics with me or anyone, please make a separate thread.
Feel free to tag me! This thread is more for my own fun.

That's all for now, will add more as I think needed.

Now let the games continue begin!
Not sure who you should vote for? Why not take the quiz: isidewith.com
Here is my results: https://www.isidewith.com/profile/3748316143/ballot
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Donator Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/25 02:34:08 )


I will likely change nicknames throughout the debate season, and will update these photos accordingly.

Part 1 of Night 1

The debates were broken into two, one hour sessions. I realized I took a crap ton of notes so while I am still working on the second hour I’ll go ahead and put up my thoughts and pics from the first hour of the debates last night.




Beto opens up early starting to respond his answer in Spanish before speaking in English.

Cory Booker thought that was genius, and took the same opportunity when the topic of immigrants came up.

Solid moment for me, Single Payer is personally my number one stance on this trail. I wasn’t sure if Warren was gonna flip flop on it or not, but she raised her hand loud and proud as well as B.Blaze. DESPITE the question being worded in a way to deliberately shame whoever would raise their hand. Good for you guys.

The Castro vs Beto spit was a oof. I get what Beto was trying to say but ultimately Castro has policy memorized down quite solid- and Beto doesn’t.

Weird flex but okay, Stewart.

That face you make when a man insinuates you aren’t helping women enough. K.

Watched the debates with my mother-in-law and at this point she gasped. “He said a bad word!” And her reaction made me laugh at an otherwise serious moment.

YES! Thank you!! This is LITERALLY my industry. It’s corrupt- get rid of it.

At first I was worried for Vin Diesel, being the only one not raising his hand. But he made sense and addressed the follow up question before the panelists asked the other candidates about. This was a strong moment for him.

Bluejay is a bit of an odd duck.

2firstnames had his ass handed to him and oof was he clumsy here.



Thoughts on highlight moments during each of the topics.

Q: Would you support a 70% marginal tax rate- yes or no?
This is referring to the different tiers of taxes we have based on income.
our current tax bracket system in the USA looks like this:


So the question is asking, who would add additional brackets reaching up to 70% from the current limit at 39%. This question was first directed to Beto.
Who really danced around the question. I’d make a fair tax bracket… and the panelists pushed. “Up to 70%?” and he dodged it again stating something about raising 28% elsewhere. Before he could further clarify time ran out.
So his answer to the exact question is No..


Castro speaking of passing the Equal Rights Amendment so that it is no longer up to state was well received, this is one of those things that it didn’t really dawn on me that not all states had this. Tulsi, pretty much completely dodged the question and took the opportunity to talk about military and war expenditures and cutting those down would help everyone. While the statement is true, it wasn’t the question and that didn’t bode too well for people. Especially when it felt like common sense this topic WOULD be covered later. Oof.

I really liked the response and passion from B.Blaze kinda low key calling out Beto for not giving a clear unequivocal response to the 70% tax margin question, stating paraphrased the only way to circulate the 90% of wealth that the 1% of our population owns, is by the high tax brackets and that no one on that stage wanting to be a leader should be acting so cowardly in not brazenly supporting that.

I was really confused at Vin Diesel’s (booker) turn what exactly was asked and what exactly he was defending/combating but the panel was harsh on him and painted him to be someone that protects shmucky corporate interests so I’ll need to look into where that came from…



Quote Klo: (on the topic of Donald trump failing to reduce pharmaceutical prices) ”We call that back home, all foam and no beer!”. Iunno bout you guys but that was somewhat cringey to me. Like a really awkward opportunity to make herself sound relatable er something lol.

Really, really Appreciated Warren’s and B.Blaze’s unapologetic stance on Single Payer and had no issue retorting the majority of people up there who were against it. The debate panel asked the question in a very loaded and bias way I felt.
The exact wording escapes me but I eye rolled it was like ”Who would kick off millions of americans from their private insurance?”
Rant Incoming
I WORK with the insurance industry. My fiancé owns a Acupuncture and Physical Therapy clinic and I do all of the medical billing, as well insurance checks and legal appeals when people are denied coverage. Let me let you in on something you might find obvious because its true for you as well. Almost NO ONE knows how their damn insurance works- if they don’t work in the field. Do you know your benefits, do you know what your deductible is at right now if you have one? Do you know what doctors can or cant take your insurance? Are you sure no matter what happens you’ll be covered? Do you know what an ICD is? MOST people don’t. People that like their insurance, for the most part just like it because so far it has covered what is needed for them. I’ve met clients in my office paying out of pocket for their insurance because they thought buying insurance had to be better than the Medicare/Medicaid they qualified for. I printed out their benefits package and showed they had about HALF the amount of coverage, and also had to meet a deductible before they were allowed any help. They had no friggin idea, and switched to the government option the following week.

Every day EVERY DAY I get people who have no clue how their insurance works. People might like their insurance but most don’t understand their insurance full stop. It’s a unnecessarily complicated and profitable GIANT that works hand in hand with the over charged health care industry. So long as you DON’T dismantle them, they WILL continue to treat this as a business and they WILL try to spread fearmongering about Medicaid/Medicare. If you have issues dealing with Medicaid and medicare now- it’s because its underfunded as well as fought by others over lower rates. The rates aren’t lower to be jerks, they are lower because they offer what most other countries consider a fair rate of pay.

I went to the ER via ambulance in 2013 without insurance. Left the ER 12 hours later that night in $13,000 of medical debt. Spammed and harassed for the next two years to pay- and the rates due kept inclining due to interest and late fees. I was a homeless 19 year old with a untreated auto immune disease- who had been putting off the doctor because I couldn’t afford to go and I couldn’t afford insurance- and NH at the time had past a law that if you didn’t get a job in a certain amount of time that your medicare would be yanked. I couldn’t work because I didn’t have a license, couldn’t get a license because I had untreated Narcolepsy.

My total medical debt after other ER visits (Er legally can’t turn you away for not having insurance) rose to $123,000 of medical debt until I was finally able to move and get insurance through MA- where most people qualify for Medicaid/medicare. Sadly due to a lack of funding and insurance industries being a poison drain- it’s a pain in the ass to deal with Medicaid/Medicare when problems do arise. They rely on other insurance companies to create their own versions of Medicaid/medicare plans in partnership with them and its those “sub insurance” companies that fight people like me from getting my very much so needed medication that is currently priced at $3,800 a month.

I have zero patience for candidates that are either too afraid, or too disconnected to understand that the problem is private insurance. Tulsi mentioned that most other countries still have some private insurance but that comparison isn’t fair since those countries have never to any remote extent had to be sapped completely dry by them. They NEVER were in the situation that we find ourselves in right now it’s entirely different scale. We HAVE to dismantle them or else people like me, will still have to fight to keep coverage of my medication, and its hard to really fight Big Pharma without kicking the pedestal out from under its best friend forever- PRIVATE INSURANCE.
Infact, people in other countries with a Medicare for all plan despite being in much better shape than US, are still dissatisfied- and I’m sure a lot of that comes from hindrances from Private Insurances getting some kind of priority over others- and enabling the system to keep shit still pricey. (Not as pricey as us of course but still a problem.) For me, it’s single payer or gtfoh.

Delaney is wrong about hospitals going out of business at medicare rates, items they need to purchase for their inventories as a result of single payer- will become cheaper. As well as more business when EVERYONE can have access to health care.

How anyone isn’t sick of calling up each doctors office “Do you take my insurance?” “is this service covered?” Imagine that, you CAN go anywhere and see anyone in your area without fear or feeling like a bottom priority. And more jobs will need to be created to accommodate the influx of patients who now have access to care.



BlueJay(Inslee): I’m the only candidate here who passed a law protecting a women’s right to choose and its covered! I’m shocked I’m the only one here who has achieved this.

….lol dude. 1)Every candidate on that stage supports that. 2) Congrats you worked with law makers who agreed with you. Not everyone has that luxury- that doesn’t mean they don’t care and aren’t consistently trying. It means the opposition they have to deal with is greater than yours.

And Klo called him out on that quite well.

Castro highlights that regardless of how poor you are, abortion and transitioning to a different sex should be always covered and Warren agreed and stated she wants to make Roe v. Wade federal law no longer up for the state. Which was strong positions to state. It seemed most of the candidates agreed, and any who didn’t – were lucky that they weren’t asked otherwise.





I believe Castro won the spat against Beto who pretty much this whole debate presented a lot of lukewarm positions thus far. (beto used to be for single payer but flip flopped away from it and pretty much every position was the safe one it felt like lol) Castro clearly had more experience with the topic as well as being able to specifically cite other relevant sections. (Sec 18-title 18-21-22 covering betos concerns about repealing section 1325)

I think Tim Ryan’s one and only solid moment of the night was when he agreed with Castro and cited how the provisions in concern already existed.
Redacting that he had a more solid part in the second part of the debate I'll explain later.

Overall most candidates who spoke felt the same.



The panel asked candidates to raise their hand, who would have signed the nuclear 2015 deal, everyone but Vin Diesel (Brooker) raised their hand. At first I was worried about what he would say but he just ended up saying he wouldn’t have left the deal to begin with and would have tried harder to diplomatically get a better deal- but if otherwise couldn’t would. Which was a solid moment for him as basically that was the follow up question by the panel to the other candidates since the consensus is the deal was a bit on the rough side.


That concludes the gist of my thoughts on the first hour highlights. Sorry I’m getting this back to you all so late, I’m at work trying to type this all up so have frequent interruptions. I’m about halfway done writing the second hour but wanted to stop to post the first half.


Part 2 of Night 1 Debates


I think the candidates that spoke got their positions out but no one really answered clearly how to handle the weapons of war already out and legally purchased.

I agree with what Vin Diesel(Brooker) said (after his initial attempt to clarify fell short) that if you need a license to operate a vehicle you should have a license to operate a gun. I think courses should be required that detail everything from how to clean and care for your weapons, what the proper storage is of them and ammunition, quiz them on statistics of gun violence, and a psychological analysis etc. When that is passed they can own a gun- and like car licenses with different classes of operation I think we should have that for guns as well. Once you’ve had your gun license without issue for let’s say 3-5 years then you may purchase larger capacity/faster discharge weapons. (idk if that’s Booker’s plan that’s just my opinion)

2firstnames (Tim Ryan), his position didn’t sit too well with me. Firstly YES I support having mental health counselors in schools that’s great for many reasons. that isn’t a gun solution he mentions most shooters are just lonely traumatized kids sick of bullies but that is the exact argument that diminishes the problem. Firstly, you can’t garuntee kids are going to go to a counselor. My school had a counselor on staff students could sign up for for group sessions and most kids would be teased being seen going into the room. Kids within the group would share private information and kids would eventually quit going as a result. Most of the school refused to even contemplate going and ultimately the program closed as a result. The sore spot Tim missed, is a lot of these school shooters are diagnosable with Antisocial Personality Disorder, which is the correct terminology for Psychopathy. NO therapy exists that has helped rehabilitate a psychopath. Not all Psychopaths have violent inclinations but those that do really do. Befriending the school psychopath isn’t the solution to school shootings. For me this was a very YIKES moment hearing 2firstnames speak.

B.Blaze shifted the topic onto wanting reform for cops as it seems prominent enough for them to lack protocol or even knowledge of rights. He had a tender moment mentioning he has a black son and this is a very real concern for him where profiling is certainly prevalent.



I liked Castro moment where he stated the first place he visited when starting his bid for presidency was Puerto Rico to give the clear message that EVERYONE matters, including our territories- and the exponential damage they had endured due to affects of climate change.

Stewart (Delaney) had one interesting moment I’d have to think about more when discussing a carbon tax that would be put into a dividend and given back to the people. I wonder to what extent and if that is his version of a Universal Basic Income (As we will hear tonight, Yang has a UBI plan for taxing technology).

Inslee’s number one campaign passion is climate change, he didn’t get to speak much so I’m curious to hear more on how he plans to tackle his number one goal.




Tulsi got the chance to fight off the prevalent but misinformed roomer that she is anti LGBTQ. She was raised in a very conservative household and was told what to believe, so for a time while still young yes she was anti-lgbtq. But she grew up and finally was able to form her own opinions and has a solid track record of supporting and helping LGBTQ rights.

Vin Diesel (booker) brought up both African Americans as well as the LGBTQ and being passionate.

[color=crimson]Castro gave a nod off to B.blaze
in agreeing we need police reform. I wish he could have expanded on that but time ran out.

Pretty much everyone on the platform wants the same things so the topic wasn’t long visited.




Beto believes we should intervene if our allies agree to help.
B.Blaze thinks it should always need congress approval.
and 2firstnames(Tim) had his ass chewed and handed on a platter to him by Tulsi I completely agree with Tulsi that we need our troops home and this endless war overseas against the Taliban is costing too many lives and resources. Tim misspoke a few times in rather serious blunders (about where and who we’re invading) and Tulsi wasn’t having any of that. This was her strongest moment of the night.

In conclusion for me
Based on eloquence, answering questions, stage performance I rank these batch of candidates like this.
Best performers on top, worst performers on bottom. My subjective opinion. For the record, I don't care about age, gender or race. For me who I like is about policy. As I said above some of the people you see high up, are not on my liked list. For me it is single payer or go home. So just because they are at my top doesn't mean I'm considering them. This chart thingy I made is strictly about how I think they performed.

Tempting as it was to put Tim on the bottom, ultimately he had a couple of stand out moments where as Steweart (Delaney) not so much. And that one part where they cut Delaney's mic because he kept talking over the panelists was a bit cringe. Note the image isn't meant to be looked at as like, left to right. I made tiers. So everyone on top I saw to be the same level. each level lower is a drop down.
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Donator Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/25 02:34:15 )


I will likely change nicknames throughout the debate season, and will update these photos accordingly.

Will post a summary after debate night.
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Donator Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/25 03:04:00 )

Democratic Graveyard
Eliminated Before First Debate:
Seth Moulton
Steve Bullock
Mike Gravel
Wayne Messam



Republican Graveyard
None yet, not their time in the season yet.
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Donator Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/25 03:07:30 )



And open!
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Donator Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/25 03:41:27 )
OMG, this is fantastic. I'm bookmarking!

Last time I was really favoring Bernie Sanders. I'm still on his mailing list cause he wants my money. lol But right now I'm undecided. I liked a lot of what he had to say last time. I've seen him speak in person twice. I still think he's an inspiration but...we'll see. I like some fresh blood, too. I would definitely like to see a female or racial minority claim the victory from Chump (as I like to call Dear Cheeto) but I'm not counting Bernie out.
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Donator — She/Her Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/25 04:11:52 )
Millet, spilling the tea:


Yup, for now he is my favorite but debate season could always change that for me!
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Donator — She/Her Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/25 18:45:08 )

Tagging @Saeyra: since I know she was interested.
I can't WAIT for tomorrow.
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Voltie — Princess Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/26 01:10:15 )

@millet: oh thanks!! Buttigieg is a hilarious name. Bet he was the butt of many jokes all his life.

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Donator Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/26 02:40:07 )



@saeyra:tempting to make that his nickname but since he's gay it sounds more derogatory (saw a boi get r o a s t e d for that)
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Voltie — Princess Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/26 12:05:23 )

@Matcha: I don't see why he doesn't change it. Especially when he is running for office like that. Its really hard to take him seriously! XD You can call him Butter Greg

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Donator Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/27 00:48:29 )
So this is what we're talking about now... lol

Well, regardless, the tube is on and I am parking it here. Just over 10 minutes to wait!
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Donator Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/27 03:00:57 )
Senator Warren KILLED it in the first hour. After that I kept wondering if she'd fallen asleep. lol Two hours was too much. I was finished after one hour of that debate. @_@

I greatly appreciated that Senator Booker and Julián Castro both talked about transgender rights without prompting. I like that Governor Inslee was so focused on climate change. Overall my opinion is unchanged; I still like Senators Warren and Booker best of this first debate group. They are fighters and I feel like they've shown their actions match their words.

I think I liked Congresswoman Gabbard the least. As a woman she should NOT have completely disregarded the question about pay inequality for women to talk about her military service. She talked about her military service in response to every single question. She made it sound like she didn't care or think the issue of equal pay for equal work for women is important. I wasn't very impressed by O'Rourke, either. I cracked up a little when Castro told him he should have done his homework. LOL!
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Donator — She/Her Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/27 03:03:59 )
Millet, spilling the tea:


(Will post all my thoughts tomorrow! Gotta head to bed now that it is over)
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Donator Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/27 19:48:33 )



@totalanimefan: and @Eldweena: and @sirlionelnigelconrad: (you can watch it on youtube) @saeyra: I posted my summary/break downs and thoughts from the first hour of the debate into the second post. I'm half way done writing for the second part of the debate. Sorry for delay just at work so having to type inbetween helping clients! Will tag ya again when I update with the second half.


Edit: fully updated.
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Donator Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/27 21:37:31 )



aaaand done in entirety.
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Voltie — Princess Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/28 15:05:28 )

@Matcha: That was a good read! thanks for the ping!

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Always ping me please.

Donator — She/Her Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/06/28 17:41:29 )
Millet, spilling the tea:


Agree with most of what you said @Sirnigelconrad: Won't really get to hear actual strong positions and debating until the race is narrowed down. At this point its a contest of who can be the most eloquent in the shortest amount of time.

Yesterday's debates were a damn mess. (won't get to update my post til next week as I have a busy asf weekend)
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Having you as a Voltie would be awesome.