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Donator — She/Her Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/19 23:54:14 )

"aThis isn't about people who truly are transgender, but the trend I have been noticing of women claiming to be trans men, but don't do anything to be trans men..... So, I am on tik tok and other social media, and noticed cosplayers, specially "trans men" cosplayers who go out, dress as girls and even on the casual time are dressed as girls but claim to be trans males..... Nothing on there social media, tik tok or anything else showcases there transitioning. All there images is them dressing as women, both in cosplay and general life but maybe with a short hair cut (not always). I am slowly taken back, especially when they go off and scream at people that they are males flashing their boobs, well done makeup, hair in pony tails and yelling at anyone who thinks other wise.

I know many transgender women and when I discussed this with them, they seem highly offended by them. There is this debate as to what qualifies you as truly being Transgender.... For me, is someone who is the opposite gender to what their biological sex is.... It is a chemical reaction in the brain, the social construct and the physical need to change in order to become what they are inside. It is not going around, dressing like what society deems as being a women and claiming to be a man because its cool.... No, that isn't cool at all. Having friend suffer daily from gender dysphoria, depression and all those thing associate with being transgender, and yet people seem to use it as a trend for tik tok likes.....

I would give links, but I don't want people harassing them or even really saying anything. It seems to be something I noticed a lot online lately, especially biological women who claim to be transgender men, but everything they show case, whether cosplay or daily life is them dressed as women.... It's throwing me off a lot. I believe that gender is a social construct but there is a limit to it. Being transgender is more then just some social construct, it's a real thing and seeing people abuse it is disturbing.

Now, there is a transgender female going around harassing young women and children, claiming t be transgender as well. Turns out, she isn't really transgender, but using the community to speak to children, create a fetish life style and she even got a company closed down cause they would't do a Brazilian wax on a male part.... You have to be trained to do that and male parts are not easy to do that too. I am sure many of you may have heard the story and transgender women are speaking out against "her".

It may not be a common thing that people do this, but it is happening and needs to be stopped. People need to stop using be transgender as a trend and start recognizing the suffering of the community , especially black transgender women who are being killed. we need to be allies and not hurt their cause!
"


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Donator — She/Her Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/20 02:39:42 )

"The thing is, everyone who transitions, regardless of whether they go one way or another, they represent who they are inside. When I see people use it as a trend, I get disgusted by it cause I have friends who been injured, killed, and even sexually assaulted for being transgender. The problem I have been seeing is many cis gender straight females infiltrating gay culture. I am pansexual, cis gender women and not ashamed of it. I know my place. Being also apart of the culture, I have been seeing more and more coming in and lecturing to older transgender people, older gays and disrespected the elders who fought and even got injured for freedoms aka Stonewall. It is happening more and more.

Now, the cosplayers I speak of pretty much went into attack mode, and went off on people accidentally misgendering them, after they showcased female cosplay, dressing in dresses, daily day events etc..... And flipped out. Which is weird, cause usually those I know would take the opportunity to educated verses scream and yell. I find it fishy. I will gladly call you by whatever gender you desire, but understand many suffer far worse. Many struggle daily with their gender identity. I have a friend who almost died cause of it."


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Donator — She/Her Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/20 02:41:16 )

"I may talk to my friend and get a better understanding of their views more. I have two who are different in their transitioning. "


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Donator — He/Him Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/20 04:23:38 )
ok first off, Jessica Yaniv is an awful person. I don't care what that person identifies as. You can be transgender and still be a complete douchebag of a human being.

don't judge a whole group of people for something one person did.

and also. no one is transtrending. It's perfectly fine to question your identity, and that is what these individuals you're speaking of might be doing. "hey, I'm unsure what I'm feeling, but right now the term trans seems to fit" and they might find out later that hey, maybe that didn't fit so well after all? plus, there is no one way to be trans. You can be feminine, identify as a man, and be assigned female at birth. You can be masculine, identify as a woman, and be assigned male at birth. You can be all over the spectrum, and that's really only for them to decide. It's also your choice whether or not you want to respect their identity.

and another thing, those people who are going to pride events and being as open as possible? they're all out there fighting for the rights of everyone. So that those people who are ashamed of their identity and killed for it, can be as safe as anyone else. I think that's important to remember.
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Donator — Whatever Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/20 10:46:20 )
Are ya ready, guyz?!

Is it just me, or is OP talking about people who don't actually identify as trans, but claim to be in order to be complete asswipes and bring about a false stereotype or ten about trans folk in general?

Put ya guns awn!
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Donator — He/They Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/20 18:42:10 )

this might ruffle some feathers, but...
Trenders absolutely do exist; some have openly admitted to claiming the "trans" label in order to fit in with a group or because they like the "aesthetic". There have been people already who attempted to medically transition, only to experience actual dysphoria as a result because they weren't trans in the first place. It does happen, and refusing to acknowledge this does the community no favors. Same with claiming that you don't need dysphoria to be trans, when dysphoria (the feeling of disconnect between your gender identity and your assigned sex) is the actual definition of the word. A lot of people are misinformed about what "having dysphoria" means, and wrongly equate it with "crippling 24/7 depression". But while that is the case for some people, no one is claiming that that's what it is for everyone. But if there is no disconnect, then you aren't actually identifying with a different sex from your assigned, thus you don't fit the definition of being trans. Everyone talks about "gatekeeping" like the worst thing in the world, but in order to actually protect trans people and help them get the medical care they need, it is very important to draw the line somewhere, and I think actually experiencing the symptoms of the condition you claim to have is a pretty fair place to draw it. Dysphoria might present itself differently for different people, but it is a part of the trans experience. If you didn't have it, then you wouldn't be uncomfortable being seen as your assigned sex in the first place. And if you aren't uncomfortable with that, then you aren't trans; it's OK to be gender nonconforming or to have issues with society's dependence on gender roles as a cis person. I get the desire to be inclusive and give people the benefit of the doubt, but no, not everyone who claims to be trans is trans. Trenders, fetishists, misinformed people, and even those just trying to make the group look bad ALL exist, and they are all at risk of undermining the trans community's fight for understanding, acceptance, and access to treatment.

As for the kind of people mentioned in the OP, I don't know them, so I can't say what they do or don't actually feel. Some people take a lot of time to allow themselves to begin transitioning, even after accepting their identities. It can be a confusing time, still living in the assigned gender role because it's convenient or familiar, but not agreeing with what that means in terms of how you will be perceived. Most will eventually move past that stage, assuming they really are trans. But there's also a chance they might not be, and just like the attention or sense of camaraderie they get for it, or maybe they just think they must be because of the things they like, without realizing that those things don't actually define a person's gender identity. It is very hard for someone who isn't trans to understand what identifying with a different sex from their assigned actually feels like. They may think they have an idea of what it is, which can lead to a mistaken ID. That's why it's so important to educate people on the difference between "gender identity", "gender roles", and "assigned sex".
I don't advocate calling people trenders just because they don't seem to have transitioned yet; you never know what their plans or reasons are. I try not to make too many assumptions and respect people's pronouns regardless of my opinions or suspicions. But some people need a reality check. If you've made no effort to begin transition, regardless of the reason, it should come as no surprise that people do not take you at your word when you claim to be the opposite sex from your presentation. It's not wrong for people to guess your gender based on the cues that you present to them. It may be rude of them to refuse to acknowledge it after you've corrected them, but it should come as no surprise if they have trouble when you make no effort to be seen as your gender.
Gender identity is not a social construct; it is inherent. You can't simply change it on a whim. Being trans is not a choice, a style, or a political statement. It is a medical condition and should be respected as such.

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Donator — he/him Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/20 18:49:15 )

so, my view on this whole thing has changed a few times, but here’s my view: Jessica Yaniv, the person you were talking about, is terrible. she has been called out by a LOT of people, i don’t know if anything has happened since i first saw it, but by the sound of it, it hasn’t.

However, Jessica doesn’t define the trans community as a whole. people can identify with whatever they want, that’s cool with me. The thing is, there are people who are trans but cannot transition for whatever reason, be it medical or otherwise. I didn’t start transitioning until recently, but i realised i’m trans about 3 years ago. that doesn’t make me any less trans.

i do think that there are probably people who just say they’re trans because they think it’s ‘cool’, but i also believe that some may THINK they’re trans and later realise that they’re not. THAT is not transtrending.
i understand what you mean, and i understand why others think it doesn’t exist. i don’t know whether it does or not, but i think it’s kind of difficult to really know whether someone is lying about being trans or not because every trans person is different.



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Donator — he/him Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/21 01:45:46 )

okay something i need to say here: if cis men can wear skirts, dresses, makeup, etc, why cant trans men?

now that thats out of the way, some replies

@SirLionelNigelConrad: yes, groups can be basically ruined by a few people doing wrong, but looking up the Proud Boys, it said that they are 'far right neo-facist'. not sure i want to associate with them ngl.

i think the whole point is that, we cannot tell people that they are 'fake trans' just because they are a feminine male or masculine female. yes, most trans females want to be feminine, and most trans males want to be masculine, for example i desperately want to grow a beard. HOWEVER there are also nonbinary folk, who will also identify as 'trans nonbinary', ive also seen some identify as 'trans femme/masc', and they will also start transitioning in some cases.
now, im not too informed on what its like to be nonbinary, but theres a nonbinary model i follow called Trinity Bree, and they started testosterone to be more androgynous and masculine. not ALL nonbinary people want to be androgynous, or will start hormone treatment, but some do.
they may also feel dysphoric about their bodies, which would make them trans by definition. so, if you need dysphoria to be trans, that would include the nonbinary people that feel dysphoria but leave out the ones that dont.

also @Bioshock: i dont think they meant to be transphobic, but i see where you're coming from. btw correct me if im wrong, im getting all this from encounters with nonbinary friends, plus the model i mentioned
block away though, your mental health matters <3

id @ everyone but im lazy lmao



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Donator Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/21 02:06:14 )
I think a good place to start would be to define the term "Dysphoria" because there's a lot of confusion around that term and what does or doesn't qualify it and I think every transperson, whether they are considered a "trender' or not, has some degree of dysphoria, be it body related or simply a matter of preferred pronouns. If you have a discomfort about your assigned gender identity then that is dysphoria. You may not dislike your body, or your name or even your overall presentation but if you want recognition that your gender does not line up with what you were assigned at birth then I would count that as a type of dysphoria. If you're comfortable with your assigned gender identity then you wouldn't seek transition, you wouldn't feel a drive to be something else.

Also I feel that gender is not something that should be equated with someone's aesthetic, social role, or personality. It is not a "who" it is a "what". I am speaking as a transperson myself, gender is how I define myself in terms of being male, female, both or neither, nothing more or less. I feel like that's what a lot of young people don't understand about gender and why they are perceived as trenders. They believe that if they don't follow gender roles or social norms then they must be trans. Honestly I think there is benefit to drawing a line (not gatekeeping, mind you) but having clear and defined terms for what it means to be trans vs gender nonconforming.

A tomboy is not a transman, a butch lesbian is not a transman. The difference, I do believe, is dysphoria. While a tomboy may present masculine or even take a role that would socially be viewed as male there is no inherent discomfort with being female, no real NEED to make a physical or social transition. Playing batman, refusing to wear skirts and even roleplaying male characters were not the things that defined my gender. What made me lean towards a masculine/male identity was my perception of self, the part that makes me trans is the part where that sense of self doesn't align with what I was assigned at birth.

I think a lot gets lost in translation between how we define ourselves, how others define us and how we define others but the core of being transgender is a desire for transition that goes beyond just discomfort with gender roles and social norms.

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Donator — he/him Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/22 00:09:22 )

@SirLionelNigelConrad: i dont think communities should be seen as bad because of a few people. for example, where i live is generally seen as a bad place because of the amount of crime, gangs, etc. there are also pretty nice people here, but its seen as bad because of the bad people.
id say the same could be sad for many other communities. the problem with knowing who is 'fake trans' and who isnt, is that no one will ever really know. if it was easy to tell i feel like this wouldnt be a discussion people actively have.
and thats the thing, people say that youre fake trans if you dont conform to gender roles, but neither do many cis people which gets really annoying if youre a trans guy and you want to wear makeup but people call you fake trans for it.
i dont think we'll ever really know for sure who is fake trans and who isnt, because theres no real way to tell, and some people think theyre trans but later learn they are not, but i hope one day no one will have to discuss this anymore.



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Donator — She/Her Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/24 17:59:41 )

"I am talking about people who fake it and come in to destroy a group of people. Seen it before in my life and had experiences, that is why I bring it up. It is taboo to talk about because people get offended easily. The reason I say this is because I dealt with it prior. My one friend who is transgender finds herself in situations in the dating world with people who flat out lie to her about their identity."


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Donator — He/They Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/25 18:56:11 )

@SirLionelNigelConrad: That's the problem with this growing push for "de-medicalization", claiming you don't need dysphoria, etc.

I can't imagine why people who are trans would want to treat it like a choice after so many decades of fighting to get people to understand that it is not one. Yet I see more and more screaming about how gender identity shouldn't be treated like an inherent, biological thing? It makes no sense, and it just fuels those who seek to label it a fad or a mental illness, despite the science backing up the understanding of gender as a built-in part of how we are made. Those things give trans people a legitimate medical leg to stand on, which is important for receiving access to treatment, and show that there is more to what they've been saying than some "political agenda" or whatever it is so many people are trying to make it out to be these days.
Unsurprisingly, when you push the claim that there is no medical or biological reason to be trans, you end up with the current situation: losing access to protections, rights, healthcare, and social support. If it's not something inherent to a person, then it must be chosen, nothing more than a social move or a change of clothes. There is no need to take it seriously, and anyone who wants to can decide to be trans for whatever reason they please. You open the door for people who claim this "identity" for political reasons, sexual fetishes, and fashion statements. You confuse and muddy the definition of the word "trans" so that now anything remotely different from the most stereotypical ideas of "male" and "female" is "trans". You end up with people attempting to transition when they didn't need to, and regretting it. Then they go on to tell other people--trans people--that it's all made up and that we shouldn't encourage or allow it. You reinforce the idea that it's "dangerous" to let children explore gender roles and presentation, because doing so will make them think they are trans. Kids who actually are trans are not taken seriously because no one knows what the word even means any more.
There needs to be a clear definition defined by the medical facts and symptoms, just like with any other condition. "Trenders" might always exist, but we shouldn't be validating them even after they openly admit to using "trans" as an aesthetic or a statement. Nobody validates the edgy teenagers who self-diagnose with mental conditions and personality disorders. Nobody should be validating people who use "trans" as a synonym for "slightly gender nonconforming".
This is exactly WHY we have people claiming the trans label in order to get away with shitty things. They are piggybacking on the fight for rights and recognition, and no one can question them because "anyone who says they're trans is trans, even if they don't experience any of the symptoms, because gender isn't biological". Therefore, they make people believe that what they're doing is exactly what "being trans" is all about.
Saying you identify as a woman to get free access to women's spaces, without even presenting or passing as a woman, is a common joke now. Because that's how people view "trans", and this ongoing narrative that you don't need to meet any criteria whatsoever to be trans is exactly why. That narrative is transphobic. Treating it like a decision made for purely social reasons is transphobic. Saying that you need to actually be trans to be trans, is not.

It would be incorrect to say that trans people can't be criminals, predators, or assholes. Of course they can. They're just people. And I disagree with all the people I see claiming that XYZ person isn't trans solely because that person did something they disagree with. But sometimes, these people make it apparent that they're just claiming a label in order to get away with things, to elicit sympathy, or out of confusion over what that label really means. I don't presume to know if people like Jessica Yaniv are really trans, and it honestly doesn't matter to me if they are or not. My biggest concern is that what they do continues to feed the public view of trans people as deviants and predators. And that the ongoing push to make no distinction between people who adopt the label for the wrong reasons and people who genuinely experience it will continue to feed that perception.

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Donator — He/They Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/27 00:13:49 )

@SirLionelNigelConrad: OH JEEZ

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Donator — He/They Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/27 01:39:57 )

@SirLionelNigelConrad: This brings up a very relevant issue.
While I certainly don't think any parents should rush to put their kids on blockers at the first suspicion they may be trans, I'm not a fan of that article. There's a lot of misinformation and fear mongering going around regarding HRT and puberty blockers, including mistakenly equating the two. Delayed or absent puberty is indeed something that needs to be looked into and treated, as it may not happen on its own, which can have a lot of health consequences. But a child on blockers will still eventually be taken off the blockers and go through puberty; which one will depend on their gender identity. That's basically the point: to delay permanent, potentially avoidable changes until the child is old enough to both mentally and physically handle transition, while also allowing them more time to come to understand their feelings about gender. I will always err on the side of caution when it comes to encouraging any kind of treatment that can have notable effects on the body or mind, especially those which may be long-term. To the best of my knowledge, though, blockers and HRT (at the appropriate ages and with proper medical supervision) are both safe and a much better answer than allowing a trans person of any age to suffer dysphoria. The permanent changes that can result from going through the "wrong" puberty can have a devastating effect on a young person and make transition more difficult--physically, socially, emotionally, and financially. It's a good reason for blockers to be considered, provided there is enough reason and evidence to believe that the child may actually be trans.
This is a pretty good point to bring up, as it balances on the edge of that question, "Where do we draw the line?" It can be a hard one to answer, especially for a parent whose child's health may be at risk if decisions are rushed into in either direction. But in all my reading about the subject so far, the conclusion I've drawn is that blockers are not a danger--and certainly not a significant one--when you remember, despite what that particular article implies, that they are not going to be taking them forever. I would be surprised if there were no health effects at all, of course, but in this case I do think the risks are minimal and greatly outweighed by the benefits. I think it would be better for a child to be on blockers for a time and end up "desisting" than to be refused any treatment and go through the wrong puberty.
Do I think we should believe anyone and everyone who claims to be trans without looking for any sign of evidence? No. That's dangerous for everyone involved and for the trans community as a whole. However, I do think everyone who makes this claim should at least be given the benefit of the doubt, up to a reasonable point. Trans people differ greatly from one to the next, just like cis people. It's equally dangerous to encourage people to disbelieve anyone claiming to be trans on principle. We should always give people the benefit of the doubt, and likewise we should always consider the surrounding evidence of any claims. Things like not transitioning for any reason (there are many reasons, such as family obligation, social pressure, financial strain, etc) are not evidence to invalidate someone's identity as trans. But when someone outright states that they do not fit the very definition of being trans, or that no one should have to in order to adopt the label, that is where I do draw the line.
It's already tough enough for trans people to be believed. I can see why there would be a push to say "believe everyone". And I think, to an extent, that's fine. But I've seen a lot of people pushing much further than that, and essentially a growing culture of seeing "trans" where it isn't. I've seen people who were not trans but gender nonconforming in some way being poked and prodded in an attempt to persuade them that they are in some way trans. People need to chill, and words need definitions.

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Donator — He/They Posted 5 years ago ( 2019/08/27 17:34:08 )

This seems to be a constant problem in pretty much every sphere, unfortunately: the black and white mentality. Things keep getting more and more extreme. Even oppressed communities are divided by blind anger and hate over disagreements in how to approach things, rather than working together. We see this a lot with the topic at hand, even here. People would rather spread misinformation and make baseless emotional appeals than sit down and have a discussion, or they just up and plug their ears. Echo chambers on both sides. There are probably a lot of factors to blame, but I guess in part it's just human nature: hear something you disagree with, get mad, push back even harder. It's a major issue with the current political setup, and it shows. The problem is, particularly with issues like these, people's lives really are at stake.

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